Dan Proft spoke with former Army Special Forces officer and Pentagon official Steven Bucci about growing instability in the Middle East, the effectiveness of Israeli operations against Iran, and the ongoing war in Ukraine.
The conversation began with a critique of Joe Rogan’s recent interview with Amjad Masad, a Palestinian entrepreneur in the tech world. Proft criticized Rogan for giving a platform to what he described as “debunked” claims about Israeli military actions, including accusations that Israel has deliberately targeted aid convoys in Gaza. Bucci agreed, stating that such claims often ignore the actions of Hamas, which has been widely accused of intercepting and profiting from humanitarian aid, sometimes even attacking distribution points not under their control.
Bucci highlighted growing divisions within Palestinian territories, including in Gaza and the West Bank. He noted that some local leaders are expressing interest in moving away from the Palestinian Authority and Hamas and seeking peaceful coexistence with Israel—some even expressing support for the Abraham Accords. Bucci emphasized that these cracks in unity contradict the narrative that all Palestinians are aligned under a singular political vision.
When asked about the two-state solution, Bucci said that while it once appeared viable, it no longer seems realistic given the events of October 7 and the failure of self-governance in Gaza. He argued that the idea of peaceful coexistence is undermined by the continuing influence of groups like Hamas and Hezbollah, who have explicitly stated their intention to destroy Israel.
Turning to Iran, Bucci discussed the covert intelligence efforts reportedly undertaken by Israeli operatives in Iran’s nuclear facilities. The recent bombing campaign, dubbed “Operation Midnight Hammer,” was based on extensive human intelligence that identified a broader and more dispersed nuclear infrastructure than previously known. While the full damage assessment is not yet public, Bucci believes the operation significantly degraded Iran’s nuclear capabilities and that the lack of Iranian defensive response during the strikes speaks to the success of the mission.
On the topic of Ukraine, Bucci addressed reports of a phone call between Donald Trump and Vladimir Putin that preceded a massive Russian drone and missile attack on Kyiv. Bucci suggested that Putin is demonstrating he has no serious interest in negotiation and is instead trying to test the resolve of the U.S. and its allies. He argued that Trump will need to shift from hoping for a deal to adopting a more hardline stance similar to the one he used with Iran during his presidency.
Bucci does not believe that U.S. boots on the ground in Ukraine are likely, but he does expect that a potential Trump administration would increase military aid and logistical support. He noted that many Americans mistakenly think Ukraine has received large sums of cash when most aid has come in the form of equipment and weapons systems.
In closing, Bucci emphasized that conflicts like those in Gaza and Ukraine require long-term strategic thinking, not quick-fix solutions. He criticized what he sees as false equivalencies between state militaries and terrorist organizations and warned against the influence of ideologues who romanticize groups like Hamas or minimize the brutality of their tactics.
Steven Bucci is a visiting fellow at the Heritage Foundation’s Allison Center for Foreign Policy Studies. He joins Chicago’s Morning Answer for regular commentary on global security and defense issues.